Multi Out not working

[Bagatell]

I got it to work in Live!

I don’t remember seeing this MPE option before. Is it new in 11.2.6?

[ed66]

@Bagatell

I got it to work in Live!

Unfortunately this appears to be an option that is only available on MAC, not on Windows! So I’ll continue my port to Reaper where there is no problem.

[ClaudioPorcellana]

@Bagatell

I don’t remember seeing this MPE option before.

Yes, I think it is in the last version
I mean MPE
Never seen the IAC driver before

Just found this

I have loopMIDI but never found how using it for multiple MIDI out
so I’m stuck on a MIDI track in the middle

[mking1]

After further research I think I’ve found the cause of the problem - the internal architecture of Ableton does not properly support multi-channel MIDI. It basically maps all MIDI data to channel 1. Other DAWs are available…

To quote from Ableton help page:

What MIDI channels does Live support?
Live can receive MIDI from external sources (eg. MIDI controllers) on all 16 channels. All internal MIDI routing within Live is on MIDI channel 1 only.

[rockbandguy]

Thx for this info concerning Cubase. But it is not working for me. I found the setting You circled in red on the left, but I cannot find the section to choose the output channel You circled on the right. Where is this view “hidden” in Cubase?

[Tristan]

Hi folks,

Lots to cover here, but Scaler’s multi-MIDI out functionality will vary given host and plugin format limitations.

As @mking1 points out, Ableton Live isn’t cut out for this kind of thing and setting Scaler as a MIDI track’s MIDI input will combine all the data across all MIDI channels into one channel.

@Bagatell ’s solution is very clever however it still uses a MIDI track with Scaler as the MIDI input (track 2) to funnel the data from Scaler to the IAC driver bus. This will again combine all the data into one channel, defeating the purpose of Scaler’s Multi MIDI out.

MPE may be able to Mimic the behaviour of Scaler’s multi-MIDI out but I’ve had very inconsistant results with this. Let me know if you were able to make this work!

I haven’t conducted much testing with Cubase, but Studio One seems to handle multi MIDI out perfectly, so long as you use the VST version of Scaler. AU plugins don’t support multi-channel MIDI output.

Given the limitation of AU plugins, you’ll need to use the MIDI effect Scaler Control plugin in Logic in front of a multi-timbral plugin like Kontakt to use multi-MIDI out in Logic.

Hope this all makes sense! Let me know if you have any questions.

[jamieh]

Here’s a thread that deals with the Ableton Live issue and it works. There is a link to download the Live file as well.

Scaler 2.7 Multi-Out template for Ableton

Hey all, Just experimented a bit with the MIDI routing for Scaler in the multi-output mode. Anyway, a simple template to help some people out with some channels routed to other instruments. For the simplicity I chose some random onboard Ableton instruments that can be exchanged for any of your own virtual libraries. Took me a while to find the right routing, but this might help some people creating their own template. Do put Scaler in multi-out and choose the MIDI FX mode.Download on Dropbox

[TheCaptainW]

@rockbandguy : In cubase you have to select in the ‘input tranformer’ the option track.

Then you have to click a second time and select ‘view page’ (or something like that, sorry my cubase is in French…)

Not very ergonomic indeed…

[rockbandguy]

Yes, the dialog should open when I choose it. At least for the first time.
Thank You!

[Bagatell]

@Tristan

@Bagatell ’s solution is very clever however it still uses a MIDI track with Scaler as the MIDI input (track 2) to funnel the data from Scaler to the IAC driver bus. This will again combine all the data into one channel, defeating the purpose of Scaler’s Multi MIDI out.

The MPE option splits the channels. Did you set the correct number of channels?

[kentel]

Ableton Live doesn’t internally make the difference between midi channels.
No way.

[jamieh]

It does using the method I posted above. MPE is the key.

[ed66]

The solutions offered in this thread involving IAC Driver are MAC solutions. (the IAC driver is a driver for Apple MACs).

I believe that the only known solutions for Windows is to set up a virtual midi bus as per the Ableton Help or to use a plug-in such as Blue Cat’s Connector (see this thread) from Blue Cat Audio.

I have not used these solutions and do not know how easy they are to implement.

[Bagatell]

@jamieh

It does using the method I posted above. MPE is the key.

If you’re only using scaler in Live you don’t need to route anything outside of scaler. You only need the IAC/MPE routing to connect to other instruments.

[jamieh]

Yep, exactly right. As noted in the thread I linked to. There is a Live file that is a template to the IAC/MPE SETUP. Works in Live 11.

[Andrew108]

Can’t get this to work at all. No individual channels showing up. Wondering what I’m doing wrong.

[kentel]

Apple and PC drivers don't work the same way. I'm talking about Ableton Live with Windows. You only can have one active ASIO driver at a time. And even with ASIO4all, it do not work. You can check on Ableton forum.All the plugins like Scaler (ChordPotion by example could output different channels, but you can't redirect them to multiple tracks). I tried, other experimented people tried. [https://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php?t=234774](https://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php?t=234774) Maybe someone could figure and code something with Max, but for now... Sorry. For now, even with a virtual MIDI driver, it's a dead end. :If I'm wrong, I will be pleased to read an answer :)

An idea for a solution could be find here and here :
https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=546393&start=15
https://cycling74.com/forums/using-a-m4l-device-to-send-data-to-multiple-midi-channels

[MrHarry]

I had the same issue of not being able to select an individual MIDI channel for the IAC Driver. Make sure you disable the MPE setting for the IAC Driver in Ableton’s MIDI Settings. It’s really counter-intuitive, but that will allow for individual MIDI channel selection again.

Also make sure that your Scalar channel doesn’t receive MIDI from All Inputs, because that will trigger a MIDI loop with the IAC Driver. Just select a specific input like Computer Keyboard or a master keyboard channel.

[panda]

For Windows and Live with an MMO source (Scaler , Instacomposer) etc I found Blue Cat to be a bad solution. It’s costs money, and there are free solutions.

It’s worth remembering that although Live doesn’t recognise channel information within tracks, it does recognise channels at the track input. This mean you can host an MMO VST externally, and pick up separate channels directly on Live tracks [This in essence is what Blue Cat does within Live; however, as far as I could see Blue Cat required the sound rendering VST to be hosted within Blue Cat - I may be wrong here - and that made its use clumsy]

There are other MMO solutions for live as well as external hosting - see the cunning one posted on this board (albeit for Instacomposer) by setting the channels to different octaves.

I’ve been pretty happy using Cantabile as a host for this - see
http://www.scaler-board.uk/cantabile/ableton-live-issues/

[ed66]

@panda

It’s worth remembering that although Live doesn’t recognise channel information within tracks, it does recognise channels at the track input.

Just to clarify Live does not recognise individual midi channels when routing midi between tracks within Live. It consolidates the midi channels into a single channel.

It does recognise midi channels when the midi source is external to Live; hence

@panda

you can host an MMO VST externally, and pick up separate channels directly on Live tracks