Scaler 2.5 Update Overview Video

Hope you enjoy scaler 2.5 all. Here’s an update video. Congrats to all the team for all the hard work.


thank you very much!!!

After 10 minutes it is clear that 2.5 puts clear blue water between Scaler and apparent competitors in this space; it underlines the philosophy that it is not about picking option 356 of pre-canned tunes, but facilitating and enabling the user to express his/her creativity - and to evolve and develop same. It’s the embodiment - in @davide 's own words - of the “composer within”

Great work, Scaler Team !


Still at job so I couldn’t download 2.5, but the video is really really great.This is so exciting and i hardly wait to get it. Excellent job. Thanks to the entire team.


wonderful news to wake up to! also answers the question how to spend this dreary Wednesday indoors :star_struck:


Amazing work! It is always exciting to receive a message saying there is Scaler update! Bravo!


Excellent work!Scaler just got even better.


Thanks @Piperpilot4 and welcome to the forums!

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As someone who uses scaler a lot for composing guitar parts, I give you big hugs :slight_smile:


Hugs aside, now I’ve played with it a bit, some questions!

With guitar voicing on, all my chords are playing an octave higher than they should be. Eg, playing a B Major, the chord chart shows that the notes should be B2/F#4/F#3/B3/D#4, but instead it plays the chord an octave higher. The octave button does nothing, and the only thing I can change in chord edit mode is the semitone.

With guitar voicing off everything plays on the expected octave and I can edit freely.

I assume I’m missing something, as there must be a way to play lower like you did in the demo video.

P.S. it would be super neat if the chord charts could reflect alternate tunings one day too :slight_smile:

Thank you for the update!
Looking forward to working with it.

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While I praise the progress being done to Scaler / development. I must say, I am somewhat disappointed how “suggestion” part was implemented. You had avid examples from Harmony Navigator, Hook Theory and Sundog studio and others who been out for years…
You are limiting yourself to your own grid. A much larger chord map (s) should be shown with colors and chord “magnetism” / relations. On top of that, perhaps analyzing a few thousand song progressions to “teach” your suggester not just “internal performances” With modern tools this should be fairly easy. You made the choice of adding Circle of fifth, breaking out of design concept. Worked well. You can do MUCH better with suggester. If I believed you were not able to do this, I would not have expressed these views. Hope you will consider some ideas. Thank you!

Thanks @Blue. I do find that when I use those programs I find myself thinking and going somewhere I had no intention of going. I like how Scaler keeps me creative and in control by simplifying things and really basing it on what I am doing, like the way the voicing follows each prior chord. Yesterday I was working on a video game and took a chord set, copied the major chords down to C and then had scaler suggest extended major and sus chords from a variety of scales all voiced correctly. It makes me base my choices on feel rather than thought. Scaler is the only program I use that does that. And that’s the reason why we analyse hundreds of chord sets written by artists for scaler that cover a massive variety. One that is greater than analysing all commercially released music over the last few decades in which a majority are written in Aeolian or Ionian. Sure, Suggest Mode can, will and should improve but not necessarily in they way you are suggesting. Looking forward to more feedback as people spend time with it.


I suspect that there will be ‘forks in the road’ coming up in this application sector.

The idea of computer assisted composition has been around for 20+ years with Band in a Box, Soundtrek’s Jammer, Tim Cole’s Koan vying for early recognition. In the last few years, the space has become (very) crowded, and when that happens the vendors all have to find some form of differentiation in emphasizing what it is they see as their distinctive competences.

It is interesting to me that many - including with Sundog, HN, and Hook Theory - have one common thread, and that is speed - producing something in ‘minutes’, and pitching that minimal pre-existing knowledge of music theory is required, {Rather oddly, Hook Theory text then delves off into modal interchange / secondary dominants / neapolitan 6ths etc which sort of indicates a certain ambiguity about the target market - is it folk who want to compose without knowing mixolydian has a #4th, or those whose goal it is to understand ‘playing outside’ and then apply it? Speed of output and depth of knowledge are, to some extent, at odds with one another.]

As an entirely personal take on Scaler (and , yes, a sample of one has no statistical value) I don’t want to do something quickly (whilst acknowledging that many do). Rather, with each project I try I am learning something about music and (importantly) more easily being able to relate each note / chord / scale to sounds.

I found something in Scaler which I didn’t find in BIAB / Jammer / Captain Chords etc etc, and that is improving my knowledge of the process / art of composition and relating that to ‘hearing in my head’ what it is I want to do. The extreme extrapolation of this is that at some point I won’t need Scaler because it’s taught me what to do - and ‘Captain’ won’t. Generating something in seconds won’t.

From what I sense in your approach, if and when those forks appear, I shall be taking the path marked ‘Scaler’.


Interesting thoughts. But in my amateur opinion, music is a very “random” process. One can hear bird chirp and toilet flush, think about the two and create a stunning piece of music. I am not trying to diminish use of Scaler, contrary to that I would like to see improvements and thoughts implemented outside the box. To me personally, grasping / learning something visually is far more superior than traditional “book” ways. Love experimenting with chord movement.

Davide, thank you for replying.

I am just a bystander. Not trying to bash your software, but making what I think valid and desirable by many suggestions, not specifically “how I want” :slight_smile:

None of the software I mentioned is perfect, and Scaler is superior in many ways, but some items are much stronger in these older titles. It is just my opinion… If you make something “new” it has to be more or less on the same or better level than what is already available.

I do not completely agree with statement you made “somewhere I had no intention of going”. I open HNvigator in “pallette” mode and nothing is pulling me into other sections / screens. I got my Circle on the right, choose key - and explore /audition. While I find HN a very useful tool, I do not see it having a bright /popular future as owner is very egocentric, stubborn, and does not even want to fix obvious bugs that do not require much time at all. Will I support that program? Most likely yes.

With Sundog is another story. It is very stable and straight to the point. In my opinion written very well. But from what I understood owner does not have plans to significantly develop it further.

There is Hooktheory “trends” which lacks most things that Scaler offers, but their funky design is very delicious and playful.

What else… here is a very fun and amusing concept. Try to press and “pull” on a chord:

About analyzing chords… Does not have to be pop / rock … It can be a wild mixture of genres from Trash Metal to Mariachi Romances to Low fi pop.

I guess my main wish is to show as much “suggestive” chords as possible on a single page, no film strip like scrolling. With visual - dynamic (as you press) representation of their relations (by color) Big open map To have the ability to poke audition them in a random manner.

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Been waiting for suggest mode, thanks so much for it. Excited!

Fantastic app. I did not know it and I have loved it.
As for the different applications to help us make music, I will tell you that I have tried many. I have Captain Plugins, Instacomposer, Chorpotion, in addition to RapidComposer. For me the best is Scaler and RC. And I suppose that many others will think differently, since each one uses the tools to do their specific job
The addition of Suggest in the latest Scaler update sounds great to me, but it doesn’t override the modulation tools that already existed and that go well beyond the circle of fifths. For example, and by the way of that fantastic application that you have kindly shared, you know that you have the option of modulating from a chord according to the works of Hugo Riemann, choosing to minimize the movement of voices or not; as well as options for secondary scales, mediants, modal exchanges, etc. I think as a classical musician that Scaler is very musical and that it can be used in many styles. In addition, the update work is very progressive in pace; Scaler is getting better and better. And that does not mean that I stop using the other programs (for that I have paid for them), but I use them less and less, and in my work template Scaler is on the first track


I asked the same question in a previous post. David explained that the basic Guitar Vocing was placed in a range more compatible with instruments in common use. I’m still getting into using these new options, but by dropping the instrument an octave I get good results.

I think it was good decision to make Scaler be somewhat optimized for use with popular instruments. The Drop Voicings offer a lot of flexibility and are in keeping with common Drop vocings used on Guitar. I’m still digging into this new feature myself. Also, don’t overlook the option to used “Extracted Voicing.” If you get a good Voicing you can Extract it and then use that. I’d totally missed that even after using Scaler for months.

Realy nice update Thank you for your nice work !!!:heart::heart:

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Same for me. What I’ve been impressed with is that each update has offered significant improvements without abandoning previous features in the program. I also like that the focus is on music. The many modulation options have helped open my ears to new sounds and new ways of thinking.